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Cell Relay Digest          Monday, 10 April 1995       Volume 02 : Number 018

Re: Broadcast Video over ATM
Re: Can I connect PBX with ATM?
Re: Where to buy an ATM shaper?
Re: Paper on Transmitting ATM Cells on Satellite Links
Re: Data Source Models
Frame Relay over DS3?
Re: Where to buy an ATM shaper?
Voice over ATM - if not today, when?
Re: Voice over ATM - if not today, when?
Re: Where to buy an ATM shaper?
WWW site for ATM chips
Switch with 3.0&3.1 handling??
a question about sscop
Re: Broadcast Video over ATM
What is the ABT?
To: 
What is the ABT?
BitFaxPro Broadcasting Problem
Re: ATM Adaptors for HP 9000 Series Machines
GTE IntraLATA toll rates
Re: Need info : advantages of ATM backbone on Ethernet backbone
Re: Can I connect PBX with ATM?
ATM Presentation by David Beering at Purdue (update)
Re: Bandwidth or Latency?
VPI/VCI and Type of traffic?
Re: ATM Presentation by David Beering at Purdue (update)
Re: Voice over ATM - if not today, when?
RJ-11 OPTION FOR CELL PHONE
Re: VPI/VCI and Type of traffic?
Antw: Paper on Transmitting
Re: ATM Adaptors for HP 9000 Series Machines
Re: ATM Adaptors for HP 9000 Series Machines
155 Mbits/s optical Rx/Tx modules
What's the ABT in RM cell format of ITU I.371?
Re: HELP: H. T. Kung
ATM Adaptors for PCI ?
Newbridge and Cisco Interoperability
Re: RJ-11 OPTION FOR CELL PHONE
ATM for PBX question

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: kjh0@gte.com
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 09:15:08 -0500, Fri, 07 Apr 95 09:13:55 PDT
Subject: Re: Broadcast Video over ATM

In article <12950405145321/0006593922DC6EM@MCIMAIL.COM>, 
<0006593922@mcimail.com> writes:

> 
> Hello,
>  
> I've seen a lot of references to video over ATM, I am specifically 
interested
> in any trials regarding broadcast quality, NTSC video over ATM.  The 
standard
> transmission speeds for broadcast video until recently have been 
about 40Mbs
> over a DS-3. Lately with MPEG 2 and some proprietary methods much 
lower bit
> rates are possible. I have read about tons of trials in the trade 
mags, I would
> like to hear about some first hand. What bit rate, what compression 
method and
> most importantly, how does it look? Will it hold up under the 
stringent eye
> of a broadcast video engineer?
> 
> This may be a subjective question, but I have found video engineers 
have 
> the best critical eye for this type of application, and they don't 
hesitate 
> to tell you what is wrong with the picture.
> 
> 
> Thanx 
> KDistel 

I havnt been involved in any trials put I have had some
first hand expierence with ATM video codecs.

MPEG2 hardware for ATM is under development by Divicom, AT&T and
others and its very, very expensive.

However motion JPEG seems to have caught on for video conferencing
over ATM.  At the Interop Trade Show in Vegas last week 5 vendors
were showing ATM JPEG video codecs:

	-AT&T,  EMMI
	-STS Tech., MMX
	-Newbridge, JPEG video card for the 36150 ATM switch
	-General Data Com, JPEG video card for ATM switch
	-Fujitsu, JPEG card for ATM service mux.

Both STS Tech and Newbridge uses a LSI chip set (I believe
AT&T uses the same chip set as well).  These codecs offer
full NTSC resolution and frame rate and the quality is quite
good.  Both of these codecs uses AAL1 (like, both vendors hardware
predates the finalized standards). However the quality is not quite
broadcast, if you have a trained eye you can see the compression
artifacts (edges are not quite as sharp). If anyone is familiar with
the current digital satilite services using MPEG then the quality
is similar.  At the higest quality settings these codecs run at 25 to 
35 Mbps depending on video content (yes VBR on AAL1!).

Another interesting way to do video over ATM is to use DS-3 
circuit emulation and then utilize broadcast quality codecs
for DS-3.  This is currentlt in use on NCIH for some
distance learning applications.  DS-3 cir. emu. certainly
uses AAL1 based on the lastest standards.

Ken Head
kjh0@gte.com

------------------------------

From: kjh0@gte.com
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 09:25:39 -0500, Fri, 07 Apr 95 09:44:53 PDT
Subject: Re: Can I connect PBX with ATM?

In article <NEWTNews.10406.797187117.pp000413@Patg1.Texas.net>, 
<atg1@texas.net> writes:

> 
> This is one of the biggest weaknesses of ATM today, no PBX interfaces. 
> 
> 
> 
> > Can I connect PBX or PABX in an ATM Backbone?
> 
>  
> 
> 
There is of course the DS-1 circuit emulation interface
for a number of ATM switches. This allows a DS-1 from
a PBX to another PBX to be carried via ATM.

Ken Head
kjh0@gte.com

------------------------------

From: kjh0@gte.com
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 09:36:13 -0500, Fri, 07 Apr 95 09:54:16 PDT
Subject: Re: Where to buy an ATM shaper?

In article <D6nrDo.K0v@sci.kun.nl>, <johnk@cs.kun.nl> writes:

> Hi ATM folks,
> 
> Does anybody know a company where I can get an ATM shaper?
> If so please provide me with details or at least a pointer.
> I'm already aware of ATecoM and CNET. I will summarise to the group. 
> 
>         John Kroeze                                                    __

Both HP and Adtech have a ATM network emulator in development
where absolute delay and CDV will be simulated, with some 
creative programing, these tests sets should be able to
do smoothing/shaping.

Ken head
kjh0@gte.com

------------------------------

From: kschultz@eecg.toronto.edu (Ken Schultz)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 09:44:59 -0500, 7 Apr 95 13:46:03 GMT
Subject: Re: Paper on Transmitting ATM Cells on Satellite Links

In article <3lutm2$hg0@ds2.acs.ucalgary.ca> njsexton@acs.ucalgary.ca (Naill Jas
on Sexton) writes:
>In the 'Scanning the Literature' section of the February 1995 issue of
>IEEE Communications Magazine, one of the journal articles mentioned is:
>
>    Study on Protocols to Accomodate ATM Cells in Satellite TDMA Links
>    Ohta, A. and Okada, K.
>    IEICE Transaction on Communications
>    Volume:  E77-B/8  Aug. 1994
>
>I requested a copy of this article through the interlibrary loan department
>and after two weeks received a copy in Japanese (which wasn't really that 
>surprising).
>
>Does an english language version of this journal article exist?
>
>Thanks!
>Niall.

As far as I know, the "E" in E77-B indicates the English version of the
journal.  What the library sent you must have been from vol. 77-B.
You should be able to get it in English.

...Ken

------------------------------

From: Andreas Grebe <Andreas.Grebe@fernuni-hagen.de>
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 10:15:04 -0500, Fri, 7 Apr 1995 17:15:32 MET
Subject: Re: Data Source Models

Christian Winkler wrote:

> In literature you can find data source models, some based on
> traffic measurements, some based on traffic theory. But in general the 
> model parameters are missing and thus the models are useless for our 
> simulations.
> 
> Any idea where to look for appropriate data source models?
> Or where to get traffic measurement data?

Roya Ulrich at Erlangen University (IMMD VII) has developed the OSSCAR
similator with various traffic generators. To my knowledge they are based on
traffic measurements known from literature. You may contact her at at
roya@informatik.uni-erlangen.de.

Andreas

------------------------------

From: coastcom@netcom.com (COASTCOM)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 11:56:25 -0500, Fri, 7 Apr 1995 16:39:31 GMT
Subject: Frame Relay over DS3?

A few weeks back, someone posted an article indicating that one of the 
Bell Companies was planning on offering frame relay via DS3. Has anyone 
heard anything more? Is there any work being done by the Frame Relay 
Forum to support frame relay services at rates higher than T1/E1?

If this is correct, I think that high speed frame relay would have a 
major impact on the market acceptance of ATM.

------------------------------

From: kfrs@ctidata.com (kfrs@ctidata.com)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 12:05:41 -0500, Fri, 7 Apr 1995 10:11:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Where to buy an ATM shaper?

John:

Contact FORE Systems at info@fore.com, they have more ATM adapters with 
more OS support than anyone.  There is a european hq based in the uk and 
field sales offices in france, germany, and spain (???).

We sell the products here in Canada and they're rock solid unlike others 
that I've been testing.

Good Luck!
Kevin

===============================================================================

Kevin F. R. Suitor		Tel.	+1 (514) 683.6363 Ext. 15
Director			FAX	+1 (514) 683.7997
Internetworking Systems		Email	kfrs@ctidata.com
CTI Datacom Inc.		Distributors of:
2250, Place Transcanadienne	FORE Systems	   Optical Data Systems
Dorval, (Quebec)   H9P 2X5	Xylan Corporation  XEDIA Corporation
CANADA				LAN Access Corp.   Western Datacom Co.

------------------------------

From: jstone@netcom.com (Jeffrey Stone)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 14:14:49 -0500, Fri, 7 Apr 1995 18:50:11 GMT
Subject: Voice over ATM - if not today, when?

Based on comments seen in the trade press and probably even on this 
board, I believe that the standards that will enable voice
traffice (e.g. as terminated by a PBX) to be carried over
ATM concurrently with VBR data traffic are not yet completely
defined.

My questions:

 1. Is the above statement true, if not, what is the situation?
 2. What work remains in standards (or implementor agreements) before
    vendors can build ATM nets that support voice (interoperably)?
 3. When might we see such standards becoming stable?

Jeff Stone
info/mation
jstone@netcom.com

- -- 

Jeffrey Stone   info/mation   jstone@netcom.com

------------------------------

From: matt@acti.com (Matt Noah)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 15:59:30 -0500, Fri, 07 Apr 1995 21:04:21 GMT
Subject: Re: Voice over ATM - if not today, when?

jstone@netcom.com (Jeffrey Stone) wrote:

>Based on comments seen in the trade press and probably even on this 
>board, I believe that the standards that will enable voice
>traffice (e.g. as terminated by a PBX) to be carried over
>ATM concurrently with VBR data traffic are not yet completely
>defined.

>My questions:

> 1. Is the above statement true, if not, what is the situation?
It is possible to do what you say.  
> 2. What work remains in standards (or implementor agreements) before
>    vendors can build ATM nets that support voice (interoperably)?
We are just now working on these IAs in the Frame Relay Forum.
Since the two are so similar, perhaps we should consider a joint
Voice Over ATM/FR technical committee.
> 3. When might we see such standards becoming stable?
You will see proprietary voice over ATM  many many months before
there is standard voice over ATM - my opinion.

>Jeff Stone
>info/mation
>jstone@netcom.com


>-- 

>Jeffrey Stone   info/mation   jstone@netcom.com



------------------------------

From: srini@starfury.igt.com (Srini Seetharam)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 16:48:52 -0500, 7 Apr 1995 21:48:31 GMT
Subject: Re: Where to buy an ATM shaper?

Integrated Telecom (IgT) has a User Parameter Control UPC chip.

check out the http site at

http://www.igt.com/

- --
srini

------------------------------

From: srini@starfury.igt.com (Srini Seetharam)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 16:51:14 -0500, 7 Apr 1995 21:50:43 GMT
Subject: WWW site for ATM chips

IgT has a WWW site listing information on ATM chipsets and
other high speed networking devices.

- --
srini
srini@igt.com

------------------------------

From: mchang@kaiwan009.kaiwan.com (Mark Chang)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 18:23:14 -0500, 7 Apr 1995 15:59:29 -0700
Subject: Switch with 3.0&3.1 handling??

Are there switches that will handle Uni3.0 and 3.1 signalling on the fly
and at the same time?

If there are, how are they doing it.  I don't see how a switch can tell
what UNI is coming across.  None of the messages have that (section 5 of
UNI specs)

Thanks in advance.
Mark


 ,+------------------------------------------------------------------------+
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+|
| Mark C. K. Chang                                        Faith Academy 85||
| Embedded Systems Software Engineer                               CSUF 91|+
| Creative Integrated Systems Inc.                             AACF Alumni|'
| mchang@kaiwan.com, mark.chang@solar.org, http://www.kaiwan.com/~mchang  |'
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+



------------------------------

From: jrc@Eng.Sun.COM (Jerry Chen)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 18:52:36 -0500, 7 Apr 1995 23:42:01 GMT
Subject: a question about sscop

In UNI 3.0, VT(PA) was set to STAT.N(PS) + 1.  However, in UNI
3.1 (Q.2110 final draft), it is set to STAT.N(PS).  Does anybody
know why?  Thanks in advance.

Jerry




------------------------------

From: Robert Sarullo <rsarullo@crl.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 19:41:59 -0500, Fri,  7 Apr 95 16:24:48 PDT
Subject: Re: Broadcast Video over ATM

>Ken Head writes:

>MPEG2 hardware for ATM is under development by Divicom, AT&T and
>others and its very, very expensive.

General DataComm is also developing MPEG2.
>
>However motion JPEG seems to have caught on for video conferencing
>over ATM.  At the Interop Trade Show in Vegas last week 5 vendors
>were showing ATM JPEG video codecs:
>
>	-AT&T,  EMMI
>	-STS Tech., MMX
>	-Newbridge, JPEG video card for the 36150 ATM switch
>	-General Data Com, JPEG video card for ATM switch
>	-Fujitsu, JPEG card for ATM service mux.
>
>Both STS Tech and Newbridge uses a LSI chip set (I believe
>AT&T uses the same chip set as well).  These codecs offer
>full NTSC resolution and frame rate and the quality is quite
>good.  Both of these codecs uses AAL1 (like, both vendors hardware
>predates the finalized standards). 

General DataComm's product uses Motion JPEG over AAL1  or AAL5.

>However the quality is not quite
>broadcast, if you have a trained eye you can see the compression
>artifacts (edges are not quite as sharp). If anyone is familiar with
>the current digital satilite services using MPEG then the quality
>is similar.  At the higest quality settings these codecs run at 25 to 
>35 Mbps depending on video content (yes VBR on AAL1!).

Key point that's missing here is:  if you are going to use VBR over AAL5, then 
the ATM 
switch must be able to provide for traffic management and policing.  Of these v
endors 
mentioned, General DataComm's APEX switch is the only platform which can do it.
  
So, unless the switch can provide for traffic management, you are forced to use
 AAL1. 
 This is why you have said "(yes VBR on AAL1!)" because you must not have stopp
ed 
by the General DataComm booth!
>
>Another interesting way to do video over ATM is to use DS-3 
>circuit emulation and then utilize broadcast quality codecs
>for DS-3.  This is currentlt in use on NCIH for some
>distance learning applications.  DS-3 cir. emu. certainly
>uses AAL1 based on the lastest standards.
>
>Ken Head
>kjh0@gte.com
>

- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
Name: Robert Sarullo
E-mail: rsarullo@mail.crl.com (Robert Sarullo)

Disclaimer:  this message represents my personal opinion only
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

------------------------------

From: dhkim@palgong.kyungpook.ac.kr (Dong-Ho Kim)
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 10:23:56 +0900 (KST)
Subject: What is the ABT?

Hi, All.

What is ABT(ATM Block Transfer Bearer Service)?
I think that FRP(Fast Reservation Protocol) is a kind of ABT.
(ex. FRP/DT is the subset of ABT/DT)
Let me know it.

Thanks in advance. 
                       Dong-Ho Kim


------------------------------

From: dhkim@palgong.kyungpook.ac.kr (Dong-Ho Kim)
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 10:27:58 +0900
Subject: To: 

Hi, All.

What is ABT(ATM Block Transfer Bearer Service)?
I think that FRP(Fast Reservation Protocol) is a kind of ABT.
(ex. FRP/DT is the subset of ABT/DT)
Let me know it.

Thanks in advance. 
                       Dong-Ho Kim





------------------------------

From: dhkim@palgong.kyungpook.ac.kr (Dong-Ho Kim)
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 10:52:58 +0900 (KST)
Subject: What is the ABT?

Hi, All.

What is the ABT(ATM Block Transfer Bearer Service) in RM Cell Fromat?
I think that FRP(Fast Reservation Protocol) is a kind of the ABT.
(That is, FRP/DT is the subset of the ABT/DT)

Let me know it.

Thanks in advance.

                         Dong-Ho Kim.
- -------------------------------------
e-mail : dhkim@palgong.kyungpook.ac.kr


------------------------------

From: jedi@docnet.infolink.co.za (Igor)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 22:13:19 -0500, 8 Apr 1995 06:58:07 GMT
Subject: BitFaxPro Broadcasting Problem


------------------------------

From: jkay@isis.com (Jon Kay)
Date: Fri, 7 Apr 1995 22:40:15 -0500, 8 Apr 1995 03:39:51 GMT
Subject: Re: ATM Adaptors for HP 9000 Series Machines

>>Vernon Schryver (vjs@calcite.rhyolite.com) boldly asserted:
> Most of us still have applications that care more about throughput
> than latency, and do not yet have many if any applications that care
> about latency.  

This is a pretty astonishing claim.  NFS is the #1 workstation network
application, and it spends way more time on back-and-forth bounces
than on the occasional pipelined, high-throughput, multi-biod
reads/writes.

In fact, if anything, I'd assert the opposite.  When I was writing
about how to achieve high throughputs, I always had a hard time
dredging up REAL examples rather than scare stories.  Yeah, there was
that scare about video taking 24 megabytes/sec/stream, but a quite
reasonable-quality 'vic' stream takes a small number of megabits, and
uses such small packets that its packet processing characteristics
have more in common with latency benchmarks than with throughput
benchmarks.  

> Besides, it takes time to port and run benchmarks.

Amen.  But perhaps the one benchmark to run if time is scarce should
be a latency benchmark.  

On the other side of the coin, those of you considering buying network
hardware and software would probably see a larger correlation with
observed performance of most applications if you asked to see latency
numbers rather than throughput numbers (of course, best is both, with
primary emphasis on latency, kind of like SPECint and SPECfp).

							Jon

------------------------------

From: maryholub@aol.com (MaryHolub)
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 05:22:48 -0500, 7 Apr 1995 22:05:10 -0400
Subject: GTE IntraLATA toll rates

Could someone please tell me what GTE's IntraLATA toll rates are. 
Specific numbers would be great but high and low floors would also help.

Thanks,

Mary

------------------------------

From: guru@deltanet.com (Bill Schultz)
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 12:03:44 -0500, 8 Apr 1995 17:01:44 GMT
Subject: Re: Need info : advantages of ATM backbone on Ethernet backbone

In <fmo.74.000D45C4@info.fundp.ac.be>, fmo@info.fundp.ac.be (Frederic Mottiat) 
writes:
>I would like to know what are the advantages / drawbacks of turning an 
>ethernet backbone into an ATM backbone, in terms of speed, ease of use, ......